p1394b Working Group Meeting,
July 14, 1998,
Hilton National Hotel,
Bath, UK

chairman:       David Wooten,
		david.wooten@compaq.com

vice-chairman:	Michael D. Johas Teener
                mike@zayante.com

editor:         Eric Hannah,
		ehannah@mipos2.sc.intel.com

secretary:      Richard Churchill,
		richard.churchill@compaq.com


Caveat and warning ... During the early portion of this meeting,
the secretary experienced serious problems with his portable PC.
The minutes that follow are thus in part a reconstruction of the
meeting proceedings.  As there were no formal votes taken on any
matters of substance concerning either the draft or group policy
this should not be a serious flaw.  However, those using this as
a record of all topics covered in discussion during the meeting,
for whatever purpose, are herewith warned that these minutes are
NOT reliable for such purposes.

Proposed Agenda

 1. Introductions
 2. Review of Agenda
 3. Review of Minutes
 4. Procedures
 4.1  Voting
 4.2  Prices and Pricing
 4.3  Call for Patents
 5. Old Action Items
 6. Task Group Reports
 6.1  B-Low Power - Richard Churchill
 6.2  PowerCon - John Fuller
 6.3  UTP - Colin Whitby-Strevens
 6.4  Upstarts - Colin Whitby-Strevens
 6.5  GOF - Colin Whitby-Strevens
 6.6  Cable/connector - Max Bassler
 6.7  Simulation - Prashant Kanhere (by Jerry Hauck)
 6.8  PHY-LINK - 
 7. Additional topics
 7.1  Multi-mode fiber issues - Mark Nowell
 7.2  Proposal to extend p1394b GOF specification
 7.3  Isochronous Resource Allocation and Reallocation
 8. Extra Items
 8.1  Liaison
 9. Future meetings
 9.1  August, Portland, Oregon
 9.2  September, Chicago, Illinois
 9.3  October, Maui, Hawaii
 9.4  December, Monterey Area, California
 9.5  January, TA meeting in Maui, Skip or Newport Beach?
 9.6  February, dependent upon January decisions ...
10. Action Items
11. Adjournment

<<< Meeting came to order at approximately 8:30 AM >>>

 1. Introductions

    Introductions were skipped, due to the fact that the attendees
    had had plenty of opportunity to get to know each other in the
    past.  New attendees were allowed to introduce themselves.

 2. Review of Agenda

    The proposed agenda was accepted without objection.

 3. Review of Minutes

    Minutes from the June meeting had not been distributed, and so
    review of the minutes was skipped, pending posting of same.

 4. Procedures

    The following procedural and policy points were discussed in
    brief.  Particularly with respect to 4.2 and 4.3, those having
    concerns or questions are referred to the IEEE standards office
    and to their own corporate or personal legal counsel.

 4.1  Voting

    Voting procedures were explained, and are as follows ...

    Voting rights on formal questions are extended to all attendees
    present at the time of the vote who have attended at least one
    of the two immediately preceeding plenary sessions.  The right
    to vote in straw polls is extended to all attendees present at
    the time of such a poll.

 4.2  Price/Pricing

    In order to avoid legal problems regarding collusion, price-
    fixing, etc., standard IEEE rules regarding the discussion of
    prices and pricing are in force.  We may discuss the price of
    things at the present time, but neither the pricing of things
    in the future nor pricing procedures or policies.

 4.3  Call for patents

    All parties who are aware of IP issues with respect to the draft
    standard, or for items that are proposed for inclusion in the
    standard are encouraged to notify the working group, and to
    suitable disclosure and notice of terms of licensing to the
    IEEE standards office.  Failure to provide such information
    may result in the removal of the offending material from the
    draft, or potentially in the loss of rights to protect IP.
    Legal counsel should be sought in any case where there is a
    concern.

 5. Old Action Items

    Old action items, which included work by Colin Whitby-Strevens to
    consolidate some information regarding GOF issues, and Liaison
    work by our chairman, were completed.

 6. Task Group Reports

 6.1  B-Low Power - Richard Churchill

    The group met, and discussion progressed.

 6.2  PowerCon - John Fuller

    Discussion was held regarding proper relationships between this
    effort and other existing and planned efforts.

 6.3  UTP - Colin Whitby-Strevens

    ***

    Other Points
    - Fall back to DS mode if the beta speeds are totally incompatible (and,
      of course, the connection is DC coupled).
    - Use ...
    ***

    Upstarts - July 98
    - Welcome, Introductions
    - Simulation Task Group feedback
      - Response to first set of comments (see reflector message)
      - More Comments - J. Hauck
    - Presentations
      - Query - D Wooten
    - Review of latest code (P1394b D0.11)
    - Open Issues
      - Code update to consistent with final version of 1394a
      - Resume latency (constant RESUME_SAMPLING_INTERVAL needs specifying).
      - Experience of Fibre Channel start-up
        - high impedance or static ...

 6.4  Upstarts - Colin Whitby-Strevens

    p1394b UTP5 Task Group July 98
    - Welcome, introductions
    - VESA Home Networking - Ozay Oktay
      - cost of 100m is no big deal
      - decided to require 100m at 100 Mbit/s data rate (do not want to deal
        with a 50m option)
      - Ozay: Move to delete 50m option, Seconded by David James
      - Motion to table: Richard Churchill/Dave Wooten, 19 for and 3 against
      - Discuss on the 1394b reflector
    - Review current specification and open issues:-
      - review specification of 50m and 100m reach
      - min TX rise time - based on short haul elec (ok - copy from other specs)
      -

 6.5  GOF - Colin Whitby-Strevens

    ...
    - Welcome, introductions
    - Revised parameters to take account of multimode fiber bandwidth issues
      - see p1394b d0.11
      - presentation by Mark Nowell (pdf to be put on p1394b web site)
      - accept revised parameters
      - liaise to TIA FO2.2 for correlation of connector losses using the new proposed conditioned launch with ditto using overfilled launch - MShariff to pospoe text
    -

 6.6  Cable/connector - Max Bassler

    Agenda
    - Review and approve of last meetings minutes
      - Approved
    - Review of past presentations - need review/feedback
      - Switched
      ...

    Ongoing Action Items
    - EMI/RFI baseline test method
      1) presentation posted on web.
      2. ...

    Ongoing Action Items
    - Matrix of physical interfaces
    ...

    Connector/Cable Reference Draft
    (Informational ONLY)

 6.7  Simulation - Prashant Kanhere (by Jerry Hauck)

 6.8  PHY-LINK - 

 7. Additional Topics

 7.1  Multi-mode fiber issues - Mark Nowell

 7.2  Proposal to extend p1394b GOF specification

 7.3  Isochronous Resource Allocation and Reallocation

    A discussion of previously presented proposals to change
    various aspects of 1394 isochronous resource allocation
    and reallocation was attempted.  Attendees were not pre-
    pared to discuss and vote on these proposals, so the topic
    and further action was postponed until after further data
    and explanations may be provided.

 8. Extra Items

 8.1  Liaison

    TIA - Telecommunications Industry Associations

    *** Liaison Letter ***
    *** Addendum to Liaison Letter ***

 9. Future meetings

    Details about the various future meetings are posted as they are made
    available in various locations, including the 1394 TA Upcoming Events
    page (http://1394ta.org/upevents/upevents.html), and the p1394b group
    home page (http://www.zayante.com/p1394b/index.shtml).

 9.1  August 18 & 19, Portland, Oregon; host - Steve Finch/SSI

    This meeting is being held in conjunction with the p1394.1 group, which
    will be meeting August 20 & 21.  The venue is the DoubleTree Hotel,
    Portland Columbia River.  Please see the p1394b web page for details.

 9.2  September 9, 10 & 11, Chicago, Illinois; host - Max Bassler/Molex

    This meeting is planned for the Hyatt Regency Woodfield, located in
    Schaumburg, Illinois, for Thursday and Friday September 9, 10 and
    11.  This meeting is in conjunction with p1394.1 (which meets
    Tuesday the 8th and the morning of the 9th), the TA ECWG (meeting
    Wednesday morning) and p1212r (which meets the afternoon of Wednesday
    the 10th and on the 11th).

    Please note that these p1394b meetings span THREE DAYS, with a high
    degree of overlap between groups.  See the note and agenda posted for
    this meeting on the p1394b web page.

 9.3  October 12 & 13, Maui, Hawaii; host - Farrukh Latif/Lucent

    This meeting will be held at the Sheraton Maui resort on Kaanapali Beach,
    near Lahaina, Maui, Hawaii, on October 12 and 13.  The p1394.1 and p1212r
    working groups will also meet at the same site on October 15 and 16, with
    one day separating their meetings from the p1394b meetings.

    This is an excellent hotel, with many exceptional features.  Look for full
    meeting details in the near future.

    Reservations must be made through Lucent's travel services, so please
    follow the directions for confirming your attendance and reserving a
    room as posted on the p1394b web page.  Reservations should be made
    by August 1 at the latest, as there can be no guarantee of room avail-
    ability after that date.  Late reservations should be forward to Lucent
    anyway.

 9.4  December 7 & 8, Monterey Area, California; host - Mike Teener/Zayante

    Plans for this meeting are still tentative, so those planning to attend
    should watch both the reflector and the web page for further details.
    Preliminary plans are to meet at the DoubleTree Monterey, December 7
    through 11, with p1394b meeting the 7th and 8th, and p1394.1, p1212r
    and TA ECWG working groups meeting during the remainder of the week.

 9.5  January, TA meeting in Maui, Skip or Newport Beach?

 9.6  February, dependent upon January decisions ...

10. Action Items

    The chairman called upon all members of the working group to
    consider the present and proposed connectors and connection
    schemes, and what these imply with respect to both the standard
    and both amateur and professional user experience.

    Richard Churchill took the action item to prepare further materials
    discussing isochronous resource allocation and reallocation for a
    later meeting.
    
11. Adjournment

    TIA - Telecommunications Industry Associations

    *** Liaison Letter ***
    *** Addendum to Liaison Letter ***

 



=====================================================
Attendance List -- 32 registered attendees

Steve Bard
steve.bard@intel.com
503-264-2923

Max Bassler
mbassler@molex.com
630-527-4490

Charles Brill
cebrill@amp.com
717-810-4642

Richard Churchill
richard.churchill@compaq.com
281-514-6984

Alistair Coles
anc@hplb.hpl.hp.com
+44 117 922 8750

Mike Coletta
mcoletta@harris.com
949-707-1143

Eric Deliot
ed@hplb.hpl.hp.com
+44 117 922 9539

Martin deVries
devries@lep-philips.fr
+33 1 4510 6917

John Fuller
jfuller@microsoft.com
425-703-3863

Eric Hannah
ehannah@mipos2.sc.intel.com
408-765-4441

Jerry Hauck
jerry@macrodesigns.com
510-668-1006

Daisuke Hiraoka
dai@sm.sony.co.jp
+81 3 5448 4603

Mitsuo Ichiya
ichiya@ca.mew.com
650-237-2366

David Johnson
dkjohnson@ti.com
972-480-3632

Abraham Katz
avikatz@rafael.co.il
+972 4 9980418

Sean Killeen
sean.killeen@ssl.ie
+353 1 402 5700

Donghyun Lee
dhlee4@samsung.co.kr
+82 331 200 8206

Jun-ichi Matsuda
matsuda@ccm.cl.nec.co.jp
+81 44 856 2082

Neil Morrow
nmorrow@ti.com
972-480-6211

Michael Musciano
musciano@lucent.com
610-712-2354

Bill Prouty
bprouty@hp.com
916-785-4631

Ivor Redmonde
iredmonde@aol.com
630-969-4747

Kyozo Saito
kyozo_s@gw3.alps.co.jp
+81 229 23 5111

Tomoki Saito
saito@ccm.cl.nec.co.jp
+81 44 856 2082

Brad Saunders
bradley.saunders@rss.rockwell.com
714-221-6513

Masood Shariff
mshariff@lucent.com
732-957-5479

John Smolka
jsmolka@ti.com
972-480-1049

Duncan Wall
duncan_wall@3com.com
+44 1442 438197

Yun Wang
yun.wang@alps.com
408-432-6413

Colin Whitby-Strevens
colin.whitby-strevens@st.com
+44 1454 611500

David Wooten
david.wooten@compaq.com
281-518-7231

Patrick Yu
patrick_yu@el.nec.com
408-488-5436

Johann Zipperer
j-zipperer@ti.com
+49 8161 80 4061