Thread Links Date Links
Thread Prev Thread Next Thread Index Date Prev Date Next Date Index

stds-802-mobility: Executive Committee deliberations on IEEE Mobility Projects - 3



MBWA ECSG E-mail subscribers,

 

I indicated that I would keep you apprised of the progress of e-mail deliberations of the SEC on the mobility projects. I have attached the two latest e-mails by Roger Marks (802.16 Chair) and myself (MBWA ECSG Chair).

 

Regards,

 

 

Mark Klerer

Chair - MBWA ECSG

. E-mail: m.klerer@flarion.com

(    Phone: 908-997-2069         

6    Fax:     908-997-2050

 

 



Dear SEC Colleagues,

 

As a non-voting member of the SEC and as chair of the MBWA ECSG I feel it appropriate to respond to Roger's assessment of the choices facing the SEC in deciding on the progression of the 802.16 and ECSG PARs on mobility. The options are those stated by Roger, as the SEC is well aware.

 

In my view Roger's note goes somewhat beyond merely outlining the options and tries to provide an assessment of how the two PARs stack up. Roger says that he could "see the issues from a wide angle"; however, his comments appear influenced by the fact that he is the chair of 802.16.   He discusses the relationships between the PARs and implies that the work of MBWA ECSG may infringe on work that may be going on in other bodies (though he does state that this may be the case for both PARs).  In this note I will provide my perspective on the issues Roger has raised, and explain why the MBWA ECSG PAR deserves to be approved and why the project appropriately belongs in the IEEE.

 

First let me reiterate that it has always been the position of the MBWA ECSG participants that a PAR that takes no a priori position about which technology is used to address the vehicular mobility space is broad enough to accommodate the evaluation of all potential technologies including 802.16. The MBWA ECSG split from 802.16 because agreement could not be reached since the 802.16 participants (although not unanimously) decided the use of the 802.16 PHY and MAC must be required - "there was no room in the inn" for any other technology. The PAR (http://grouper.ieee.org/groups/802/mbwa/Dot16_Ar/80216sgm-02_05.pdf) that was rejected by 802.16 in July had no statement about the technology to be adopted and (at the insistence of 802.16 participants) was constrained only to using spectrum licensed for mobile application with no upper limit on the frequency range. That PAR was a true superset of the two subsequent PARs currently under consideration. The current MBWA ECSG PAR addresses the "sweet spot" in mobility, i.e. a maximum operating frequency of 3.5 GHz. As described in the Five Criteria, the project is eminently realizable from both a technological and economic viewpoint as it can utilize technologies already  used for or optimized for high performance, high capacity IP-based mobile services.

 

The MBWA ECSG proposed project is unique in scope both within the currently authorized work in 802 and SDOs other than the IEEE. In contrast to work currently ongoing in the Partnership Projects (3GPP and 3GPP2  http://www.3gpp.org/Management/WorkPlan.htm & http://www.3gpp2.org/Public_html/SC/SC-20010201-010_PMT_Chair,3GPP2_Workplan_V23.xls), the MBWA ECSG PAR is focused on:

 

1.       A Radio Access Network (RAN)  that is optimized to support broadband packet data, specifically to support the transport of IP traffic, and

2.       A pure  packet switched network infrastructure, rather then the current 3G predominantly circuit switched control infrastructure and architecture

 

This emphasis makes the project a perfect complement to existing projects in the IEEE that are focused on an all packet switched environment. That being said, it is obvious that just like in the land-line telephony environment where there is a trend to unify voice and data on a packet switched infrastructure, this trend will also occur in the wireless environment. For that reason, the MBWA ECSG PAR identifies the 3G partnership projects and the ITU as a liaison organization with which cooperation is expected to occur. Liaison overtures have been made, but as a short lived SG it would have been inappropriate to commit to a long lasting relationship at that time. Instead, as the PAR indicates, these relationships will be established when the SEC has approved the PAR and established a new Working Group.

 

 

To address Roger's specific points:

 

(1) It is stated that "802.16 believes that the natural evolution of its broadband wireless access technology is to allow its terminals (in licensed bands below 6 GHz) to move during operation". It is not at all clear how the work proposed is a "natural evolution" for 802.16. The Working Group is chartered to work on fixed broadband wireless and covers both unlicensed and licensed bands. Its current specs are for the 2-11 GHz (.16a) and 10-66 GHz (.16). These are both different from the "licensed spectrum < 6 GHz" band that is targeted with the new PAR. A more natural evolution would have been to allow limited mobility of terminals, with backwards compatibility to fixed terminals, operating in the current bands.  

 

As stated above, the MBWA ECSG PAR advocates the development of a specification that is optimized for macro-cellular mobility and makes no a priori assumptions about technologies to be used. Trade-offs involved in supporting mobility are significantly different than those made to support fixed wireless operation. The MBWA ECSG PAR infringes neither on the work of 802.11, the current work of 802.16 or the work of 3GPP or 3GPP2.

 

(2) In this point it is argued that "station speed" should not be used as a "differentiator" since it has not been used as such in the past in IEEE 802. For a project whose focus is on mobility, however, station speed is an obvious key parameter in the specification of the project.  Any PAR for a mobile standard that does not clearly and adequately address speed is incomplete.

 

The distinction proposed based on speed is actually supported by Roger himself in a suggestion made by him in http://ieee802.org/16/arc/802-16-mobile/msg00032.html advocating a two PAR approach. One PAR would address vehicular mobility. The other PAR, produced by or for 802.16, "would be defined as an amendment to IEEE Std 802.16 to introduce limited mobility and portability. Depending on the WG consensus, this might broaden to repeaters, MAC management, and some of the other issues brought up at the last TGa meeting, as recorded in the minutes (802.16a-02/10)."

 

Roger states that the distinction based on speed would "limit one to low speeds while placing no limits on the other". The MBWA ECSG PAR does specify a challenging design envelope with a maximum speed limit of 250 km/h and a minimum sustained spectral efficiency of 1b/s/Hz/cell. The 802.16 SG charter, on the other hand, was to evaluate what degree of mobility could be supported with the constraints of the existing 802.16 PHY and MAC specifications (comprised of technologies optimized for relatively static channels and wide channel bandwidths) and possible (minor?) enhancements to that PHY and MAC. In other words the terminal speed limit would fall out naturally from the evaluation of the capabilities of existing 802.16 PHY and MAC technology. This evaluation was to have been done during the first two meetings of the new 802.16 SG (http://grouper.ieee.org/groups/802/16/mobile/docs/80216sgm-02_08.pdf ). This evaluation of an 802.16 compliant system was not done.

 

(3) Roger raises the issue of how one or both of these PARs relate to the 3G Partnership Projects and how this might impact the relationship between the Partnership Projects and the IEEE LMSC. In describing the liaison meeting with T1P1, one is left with the impression that the MBWA ECSG project and 802.16 SG project were perceived differently by T1P1.  However,  the description of events at the T1P1 meeting are based on a presentation of an 802.16 SG scope and purpose (limited mobility)   that are not consistent with the changes in  the scope and purpose of the current 802.16 SG PAR under consideration. When the 802.16 WG voted to terminate the efforts of the MBWA in July 2002, it immediately established a Mobile WirelessMAN committee whose charter was to evaluate what mobility characteristics could be supported by 802.16a compliant systems. As stated previously, that evaluation was not done. The 802.16 project presented to T1P1 was an evaluation project and is not representative of the operational characteristics of the final PAR. Here are excerpts from the T1P1 minutes (ftp://ftp.t1.org/T1P1/2002/2P100970.pdf ) characterizing the presentation.

 

"Dr. Marks explained that two new areas of work were being explored in IEEE 802.  The first area of work focuses of expanding the current 802.16 standards to support mobility functions. The second potential area of work, outside of 802.16 would produce standards for Mobile Broadband Wireless at Vehicular Speeds. 

 

Work in 802.16 to extend Standards to include Mobility

 

Dr. Marks noted that at this point this activity is at the study group level, and the actual direction of the work was still under discussion and is evolving.  Dr. Marks noted that 802.16 groups lacked expertise in areas such as hand-off, layers higher than MAC, etc., and T1P1 with extensive knowledge in these technical areas could provide a helping hand." 

 

As stated previously, I believe that the ECSG PAR as defined now is distinct from current work in the Partnership Projects in that it addresses a data optimized air-interface for a pure packet switched infrastructure.

 

In closing, it should be noted that the MBWA ECSG PAR and Five Criteria are the product of seven months of deliberate work, with significant participation and consensus from a large number of interested parties and I would urge you to approve the MBWA ECSG PAR on it's merits and establish a new MBWA Working Group to develop Mobile Broadband Wireless Access standards.   Conversations with leaders in various 3G partnership organizations have actually shown that they would be very much interested in liaising and cooperating with such an effort.

 

I believe an IEEE 802 MBWA project will be the driving force for the development of a world class commercially successful vehicular mobility solution for broadband wireless data that will enhance IEEE LMSC's reputation for excellence and continue the IEEE LMSC's wireless success story.

 

Best Regards,

 

Mark Klerer

 

 

 





Title: Re: [802SEC] Mobile Broadband Wireless Access--distinction between the ECSG and 802.16 SG

Dear SEC Colleagues,

I agree with Paul that the two mobile broadband PARs before the SEC have a lot in common. However, the question before us is not simply "Which one do we approve?" Instead, the choices we are have are "either, both, or neither". I'd like to discuss this from an SEC perspective, not from an 802.16 perspective. While I don't pretend to be unbiased, I think I can see the issues from a wide angle.

Here are three basic ways to address the problem:

(1) Approve either the 802.16e PAR or the MBWA SG PAR and reject the other on the basis of overlap. 802.16 believes that the natural evolution of its broadband wireless access technology is to allow its terminals (in licensed bands below 6 GHz) to move during operation. The MBWA SG would like 802 to develop, from scratch, a standard to cover mobile broadband wireless access. The SEC could choose one of these two options. Since the SEC is not an ideal forum for technical decisions, it would probably have to look beyond technical issues and delve fairly deeply into the Five Criteria.

(2) Identify overlap and, if warranted, fix it; then approve both PARs. Since both PARs can be revised during the Plenary session, the potential overlap could be addressed during the week. My impression is that intent of the two Study Groups is somewhat different, and it is possible that the different intentions could be made more explicit within the PARs. Addressing this problem may require thinking more deeply about the differences than to simply say that one is for "high mobility" and one for "low mobility". In the past, 802 has found a way to distinguish its wireless standards without invoking station speed as a differentiator, and I don't see that we need to start now. Furthermore, speed would be an incomplete and non-neutral way to make a distinction because, instead of drawing a line between the two applications, it would limit one to low speeds while placing no limits on the other.

(3) Look at each PAR independently on its own merits and decide whether either is worthy of approval, rejecting both if warranted. I would specifically like to raise the issue that one or both PARs might overlap with existing standards outside of 802: namely, in the mobile telecommunications business. Standards for third-generation (3G) mobile wireless have already been developed, at enormous cost and huge political ramifications, by many of the world's national and international standards-developing organizations. Many of these SDOs have subsequently banded together into partnerships to refine and implement those standards. The SEC needs to think about the wisdom of going into competition with these elephants. It needs to consider whether it is stepping over a line and, if so, it needs to estimate the chances of competing successfully and weigh the possible consequences. Consider, for example, that 3G SDOs trying to interwork their systems with 802.11 LANs have scrupulously avoided treading on the toes of 802. The SEC needs to consider the impact on 802 should we be less than scrupulous in return. Here is some material to consider:

*One of the major U.S. 3G developers is TIA's TR-45. A recent announcement of a TIA teleconference on WLANs, by TIA's Director of Standards Development & Promotion, was posted to the 802.11 reflector. It included this: "Cheryl Blum, Chair of TR-45, reported on a discussion which was held the previous day at the TR-45 plenary on the role of TIA with regard to Wireless LAN standards and interoperability with TIA air interfaces. The concern expressed by TR45 was preventing overlap of work. IEEE is already the recognized expert in the standards arena for standards development related to WLAN and there is no need to step on toes or to duplicate work. Certain boundaries need to be defined for TIA when considering the technical areas that TIA could pursue."

*The same announcement referenced a visit I made to T1P1, the other major U.S. 3G developer, at their invitation following the initiation of 802.16's mobile work. The visit took place after 802 had established two Study Groups in this mobility area, and Mark Klerer (Chair of the MBWA SG) also attended. The record of the meeting <http://ftp.tiaonline.org/TechCommittee/Working/2002September/TC-20020905-012_T1P180216meetingreport.doc> shows that T1P1 was enthusiastic about joint work (responding positively to my suggestion of a handoff tutorial at the November Plenary). On the other hand, the report also shows significant concern on the part of T1P1 regarding 802 efforts that that might tread on their territory.

My bottom line is that we need to be careful with both PARs lest they put 802 into an encroaching position.


Overall, I suggest that the best way to tackle this problem is with a combination of (1), (2), and (3), like this:

(a) Will the 802.16e PAR be good for 802? If so, then approve it.
(b) Will the MBWA SG PAR be good for 802? If so, then approve it.

However, if (a) and (b), then:
    If the overlap between the two PARs is tolerable then:
        Approve both
    Else (If the overlap between the two PARs is intolerable)
        If the proposing groups resolve the overlap, then:
            approve both PARs
        Else (if the proposing groups can't resolve the overlap)
            choose one, reject both, or charter further Study Group activity

These cases get pretty complicated. As an SEC member, I would expect both proposing groups to participate in working through all this.

In summary, I recommend that the SEC view its options broadly, considering the interests of 802, and not get hung up with the battle between two proposals.

Regards,

Roger


>Dear SEC members,
>
>Both the Executive Committee Study Group on Mobile Broadband Wireless Access and the 802.16 Mobile Wireless Access Study Group have submitted Project Authorization Requests for projects that, as far as I can tell from the PARs, address the same market and application space.  This concerns me.

>
>The only substantive difference in the PARs that I can see is that the 802.16 SG proposes to amend the 802.16 MAC/PHY to enable mobile operation, while the ECSG does not presume using the 802.16 standard as a starting point.  This confuses me-when we approved the 802.16 SG in July, it was to focus on enhancements to the 802.16a PHY/MAC for 'limited mobility' in the 2-11GHz band, whilst the ECSG was targeting 'high mobility' in the sub 3.5GHz band.  This established some, albeit small, distinction between the ECSG (0-3.5GHz, up to 250km/h) and 802.16 SGs (2-11GHz, limited mobility) activities.  Now, the gap has narrowed-narrowed to the point that I think the SEC must consider whether or not it makes sense to have two projects with such similar scope.

>
>I would like to hear what other members of the SEC think about the overlap between these two PARs-any opinions out there?

>
>Regards,
>
>--Paul Nikoich