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P&P: RE: Fw: Fw: SUO: MSO ballot canceled due to new IEEE voting rules
Dear Jim,
Some comments below.
Matthew West
Principal Consultant
Shell Information Technology International Limited
Shell Centre, London SE1 7NA, United Kingdom
Tel: +44 20 7934 4490 Mobile: +44 7796 336538
Email: matthew.west@shell.com
Internet: http://www.shell.com
http://www.matthew-west.org.uk
> -----Original Message-----
> From: jim.s3@juno.com [mailto:jim.s3@juno.com]
> Sent: 26 February 2004 13:28
> To: suo-policies@ieee.org
> Subject: P&P: Fw: Fw: SUO: MSO ballot canceled due to new IEEE voting
> rules
>
>
>
> SUO P&P,
>
> Here are my ideas on the new IEEE email voting rule.
>
> 1. SUO may be in only IEEE standards WG that meets only via
> email. Other
> WGs probably don't care about the tougher email rule, since they can
> simply wait until their next meeting a take a simple majority vote. I
> don't agree with the new rule, but I also don't think it's worth the
> effort to try to get it changed.
MW: My experience in ISO is that more difficult issues are often handled
by "letter" ballot (conducted by e-mail). On the other hand, I also recall
they use the same vote counting approach for both.
MW: On the other hand I also think it is not worth trying to change. It is
much more important to have certainty in how votes will be counted.
>
> 2. As a minimum, we need to educate all voting members. I suggest we
> draft a brief explanation, send it out, and ask everyone to
> report back
> that they read. Any volunteers to write a draft?
MW: Agreed. I am happy to write a draft, but I am quite busy just
at the moment, so there will be a delay.
>
> 3. I don't think we can require people to cast votes, but I
> do suggest we
> express the importance of everyone taking the time to take a
> postion and
> cast a vote on every ballot.
MW: I think we need to point out that being a responsible voting member
is onerous.
>
> 4. In the long run, I don't this rule will matter much. The final WG
> step is to send a 'Committee Draft' to IEEE for formal
> balloting, which
> to pass there usually requires far more than a slim majority
> in the WG.
MW: Quite.
> I hope we all understand the IEEE formal balloting group will be a
> different set of people from our WG. One must be a member of the IEEE
> Standards Association, so many SUO WG members will likely not join.
> Also, new standards professionals with a stake or interest in the
> document will join.
MW: I doubt if this is widely understood.
>
> Jim
>
>
>
> --------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: jim.s3@juno.com
> To: suo-policies@ieee.org
> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:49:11 -0500
> Subject: Fw: SUO: MSO ballot canceled due to new IEEE voting rules
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
> Matthew (Chair) and SUO P&P Group,
>
> Given this new IEEE rule for email votes, request you
> review the
> current SUO rule for retaining voting rights.
>
> Jim Schoening
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: jim.s3@juno.com
> To: standard-upper-ontology@ieee.org
> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:06:53 GMT
> Subject: SUO: MSO ballot canceled due to new IEEE voting rules
>
> SUO Voting Members,
>
> Below is an IEEE announcement of how email votes should now be
> counted.
>
> The rule is 'Majority of all voting members,' which equates to
> Yes > (No + ABSTAIN + Non-votes).
>
> The rule applies immediately to new votes, but not
> prior votes.
> I asked an IEEE rep who said it even applies to a vote in process.
>
> As such, I feel I must cancel the current MSO vote
> until we can
> sort this out and educate all voters to the new rules.
>
> I believe this new rule will work fine, but only if all voting
> members take the time to determine their position and cast a vote. As
> such, I will ask the SUO P&P group to take another look at
> the SUO rules
> for retaining voting rights. If anyone wants to join this group,
> send the message: subscribe suo-policies
> to the address majordomo@ieee.org
>
> Incidently, for in-person meetings, IEEE clarified the voting
> rule to be Yes > No, given a quorum.
>
> Jim Schoening
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: d.ringle@IEEE.ORG [mailto:d.ringle@IEEE.ORG]
> Sent: Friday, February 20, 2004 2:03 PM
> To: STDS-WG-CHAIRS@listserv.ieee.org
> Subject: Message from IEEE-SA Standards Board Chair on Voting Rules
>
>
> IEEE Sponsors:
>
> I would like to inform you of two IEEE Bylaw changes that
> were approved
> by
> the IEEE Board of Directors in November 2003. Those changes,
> which are at
> the highest level of IEEE procedures and therefore supercede IEEE
> Standards
> Sponsor and Working Group procedures, affect the IEEE-SA
> Standards Board
> and all other IEEE Standards-developing groups (such as sponsors and
> working groups).
>
> The first change concerns how abstentions are considered in
> any vote held
> at a face-to-face meeting or during a teleconference. The
> rules now state
> that abstentions no longer count toward the total number needed to
> approve
> or disapprove an action. What is needed is a majority of the
> votes cast,
> either approve or disapprove, to determine a decision. This change is
> given
> in IEEE Bylaw I-300.4 (1).
>
> The second change covers votes taken via email. Any email
> ballot needs to
> receive approval from a majority of voting members (all
> official members
> of
> your group) to allow an action to be taken. It should be noted that
> unofficial actions, such as straw polls, do not need to
> follow this rule.
> This change is contained in IEEE Bylaw I-300.4 (4).
>
> You can read these two bylaw changes here:
> http://www.ieee.org/portal/index.jsp?pageID=corp_level1&path=a
bout/whatis
/by
laws&file=i-300.xml&xsl=generic.xsl
These changes are now the official rules, and you should begin to follow
them immediately. Any previous actions taken are not affected by these
rules. Please ensure that your Sponsor or Working Group procedures are
not
in conflict with these revised Bylaws. Remember that you can default to
the
IEEE Bylaws as well.
If you have any questions concerning these new rules, please contact Mary
Lynne Nielsen (m.nielsen@ieee.org) or Dave Ringle (d.ringle@ieee.org.)
Sincerely,
Don
**********************************************
Don Wright don@lexmark.com
Chair, IEEE SA Standards Board
Member, IEEE-ISTO Board of Directors
f.wright@ieee.org / f.wright@computer.org
Director, Alliances & Standards
Lexmark International
740 New Circle Rd
Lexington, Ky 40550
859-825-4808 (phone) 603-963-8352 (fax)
**********************************************
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