Hello Dave, Mark and all,
Thank you for your inputs.
I have updated doc 22/0398 to incorporate your feedback. See:
https://mentor.ieee.org/802.11/dcn/22/11-22-0398-02-000m-proposed-resolution-for-spp-a-msdu-support.docx
Note that the update in 22/0398r2 is in the discussion section, no additional change to the proposed change section.
Regards,
Emily
From: Mark Rison <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2022 2:30 AM
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] Do S1G STAs do SPP?
--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---
Hello Dave,
The answer is not necessarily, since it depends on the setting of the SPP capable and SPP required bits in the RSN capabilities field. As I answered previously, SPP A-MSDU is optional
for S1G and all other STAs except DMG STAs. If an S1G STA implements A-MSDU then it acts the same as a VHT STA, for example. There is no difference in behavior for S1G STAs vs other non-DMG STAs in this area as far as I can see.
OK, thanks. (I'm not sure why this is, since S1G long postdates
the introduction of SPP, which was a last-minute hack because
people wanted to rush out 11n D2.0…).
So it sounds as if the proposed resolution in 22/0398r1 is correct
for S1G STAs too, though the discussion sentence:
Note that the “SPP A-MSDU Capable” bit is only for HT STA (non-DMG STA). DMG
STAs always use SPP A-MSDU.
is confusing and should be something like:
Note that the “SPP A-MSDU Capable” bit is only for non-DMG STAs (e.g. HT STAs and S1G STAs). DMG
STAs always use SPP A-MSDUs.
Thanks,
Mark
--
Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN English/Esperanto/Français
Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre Tel: +44 1223 434600
Innovation Park, Cambridge CB4 0DS Fax: +44 1223 434601
ROYAUME UNI WWW:
http://www.samsung.com/uk
From: David Goodall <dave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, 16 March 2022 08:26
To: Mark Rison <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] Do S1G STAs do SPP?
Hi Mark,
On Wed, Mar 16, 2022 at 6:21 PM Mark Rison <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Hello Dave,
>> A question arose in the TGme session yesterday: do S1G STAs always send A-MSDUs as SPP A-MSDUs (like DMG STAs, but unlike HT STAs)?
A-MSDU support is optional for S1G STAs. SPP A-MSDU is optional for an S1G STA that supports A-MSDUs. I think that is the case for all non-DMG STAs.
OK, let me make my question clearer:
If an S1G STA sends an A-MSDU, does it always send it as an SPP A-MSDU
(if encryption is enabled, of course)?
The answer is not necessarily, since it depends on the setting of the SPP capable and SPP required bits in the RSN capabilities field. As I answered previously, SPP A-MSDU is optional
for S1G and all other STAs except DMG STAs. If an S1G STA implements A-MSDU then it acts the same as a VHT STA, for example. There is no difference in behavior for S1G STAs vs other non-DMG STAs in this area as far as I can see.
>> If they don't, does anyone actually implement SPP A-MSDUs in S1G STAs?
Unknown. As far as I know, industry is not yet conducting interoperability testing for S1G support of A-MSDUs. If/when that happens SPP A-MSDUs will probably be the requirement.
Well, the alternative question is: do S1G STAs use the SPPR and SPPC
bits in the RSN Capabilities field to determine whether, if A-MSDUs
are used, these are SPP A-MSDUs or not?
Yes, the behavior is the same as for any non-DMG STA.
The above comments apply to PV0 frames. I'm not sure what the context was for the discussion in TGme. Why are we picking on S1G in particular? :-)
Because the rules are clear for HT STAs (look at the bits to determine
whether SPP) and DMG STAs (always SPP) but not for other STAs.
The original 802.11ah-2016 text did specifically reference HT STAs but that seems to have been removed in the latest 802.11me draft. What part of the current 802.11me draft are you
referring to?
- Dave
Thanks,
Mark
--
Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN English/Esperanto/Français
Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre Tel: +44 1223 434600
Innovation Park, Cambridge CB4 0DS Fax: +44 1223 434601
ROYAUME UNI WWW: http://www.samsung.com/uk
From: David Goodall <dave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, 16 March 2022 03:35
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] Do S1G STAs do SPP?
--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---
>> A question arose in the TGme session yesterday: do S1G STAs always send A-MSDUs as SPP A-MSDUs (like DMG STAs, but unlike HT STAs)?
A-MSDU support is optional for S1G STAs. SPP A-MSDU is optional for an S1G STA that supports A-MSDUs. I think that is the case for all non-DMG STAs.
>> If they don't, does anyone actually implement SPP A-MSDUs in S1G STAs?
Unknown. As far as I know, industry is not yet conducting interoperability testing for S1G support of A-MSDUs. If/when that happens SPP A-MSDUs will probably be the requirement.
The above comments apply to PV0 frames. I'm not sure what the context was for the discussion in TGme. Why are we picking on S1G in particular? :-)
If it relates to CID 1555, which concerns A-MSDUs in an S1G PV1 frame, then I think there are definitely issues for A-MSDUs in that context but that is a separate discussion.
- Dave
On Tue, Mar 15, 2022 at 11:59 PM M Montemurro <montemurro.michael@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Copying the TGm reflector
On Tue, Mar 15, 2022 at 5:40 AM Mark Rison <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Hello,
A question arose in the TGme session yesterday: do S1G STAs always
send A-MSDUs as SPP A-MSDUs (like DMG STAs, but unlike HT STAs)?
If they don't, does anyone actually implement SPP A-MSDUs in S1G STAs?
Thanks,
Mark
--
Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN English/Esperanto/Français
Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre Tel: +44 1223 434600
Innovation Park, Cambridge CB4 0DS Fax: +44 1223 434601
ROYAUME UNI WWW: http://www.samsung.com/uk
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