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RE: *** SEC Motion to forward 1000BASE-T(IEEE 802.3ab) to REVCOM

Our past experience with standards that were forwarded without any
implementations to verify their correctness has not been good.  This is a
lengthy and complex draft and the process of building and testing real
implementations is likely to uncover problems.  The responses to the ballot
comments on this just brush off the comments rather than resolving them.
While the document has come very far and I appreciate the efforts of the
task force, I cannot vote to forward it at this time.

Further, I strongly object to the categorization of my ballot comments as a
request to see "proof of concept."  That is not the issue I raised.  I
believe that the "concept" at least in broad strokes has been adequately
proven.  My concern is with the accuracy and completeness of the
specification.  Implementation experience is the tool that lets us test
whether, at a detail level, the correct specifications have been included to
allow interoperable devices to be designed.  In implementation and testing,
we find the specs that are too tight to be met, the omissions, the
contradictions and the errors that occur in a complex specification.

IEEE has a tool for forwarding a document that is good but not yet well
proven in its details; a trial use specification.  This status would
correctly inform the reader of the status of this document.  It would set up
a process for collection of comments for the next two years as we gain
implementation experience.  I could support forwarding the document as a
trial use standard.

I vote against the motion.

Pat Thaler

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jim Carlo []
> Sent: Thursday, May 06, 1999 11:26 AM
> Subject: *** SEC Motion to forward 1000BASE-T(IEEE 802.3ab) to REVCOM
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> ++++++++++++++
> SEC OFFICIAL EMAIL BALLOT     802.0/6May1999
> Issue Date:   6May1999          Closing Date: 14May1999
> Moved By:     Geoff Thompson
> Seconded By:  Bob Grow
> Move: Authorize forwarding 802.3ab (1000BASE-T) to RevCom for 
> approval at the
> June1999 IEEE-SA Standards Board Meeting contingent on the 
> approval of a letter
> ballot motion from the voters of 802.3 scheduled to close May 10.
> Notes:
> If you recall there was a quite contentious issue at the March meeting
> regarding a request from some members to see a "proof of 
> concept" before 802.3
> authorized it to go forward. There was no motion to go 
> forward passed at the
> closing plenary of 802.3 in March.
> There is currently a 30 day 802.3 Working Group letter ballot 
> which closes May
> 10 to approve the placement of 802.3ab on the REVCOM agenda. 
> The current status
> of that motion is detailed below.
> Supporting information
> The Sponsor Recirculation Ballot for P802.3ab/D6.0 
> (1000BASE-T) closed on April
> 5. The results of that ballot were:
> 	60	Number of eligible people in Ballot Group
> ___________________________________________________________
> 	44	Affirmative votes
> 	 2	Negative votes (Frazier, Thaler)
> 	 1	Abstention vote
>    ________
> 	47 	Votes = 78% Returned
> 		         2% Abstention
> 	46/48	        95% Affirmative
> There were comments from 3 voters during the recirculation
> 	Thaler  -  Supports Seifert's proposal for "Trial-Use"
> 	Seifert -  Previous plus minor editorial (to be 
> corrected during prep for
> pub.)
> 	Booth   -  Minor editorial (to be corrected during prep 
> for pub.)
> (The complete comments are attached to this message as 
> d60comments.doc))
> With this the Sponsor Balloting process is complete. The 
> draft has met all of
> the IEEE requirements for approval, consensus and 
> recirculation. It is ready to
> go to REVCOM for approval by the IEEE Standards Board. There 
> was no meeting
> held to resolve comments as there were no "new negatives".
> There is an 802.3 Working Group letter ballot motion 
> currently being conducted
> by e-mail to place P802.3ab/D6.0 on the June REVCOM agenda.
> The results to date (cob May 3) of the Working Group letter 
> ballot motion to
> forward are:
> 	75	Affirmative votes
> 	 1	Negative votes
> 	 4	Abstention vote
>    ________
> 	80 	Votes = 53% Returned
> 		        <1% Abstention
> 	75/80	        98% Affirmative
> This ballot closes on May 10.
> The ballot has achieved the 75 votes returned by 802.3 voters 
> that it needs to
> meet the quorum requirement. If the ballot does not pass then 
> the matter of
> forwarding the draft will be
> on the agenda of the July meeting of 802.3. P802.3ab would 
> then not be a
> candidate for approval as an IEEE Standard until September 1999.
> Jim Carlo( Cellular:1-214-693-1776  Voice&FAX 
> Mail:1-214-853-5274
> TI Fellow, Networking Standards at Texas Instruments
> Chair, ISO/IEC JTC1/SC6 Telecom and Info Exchange Between Systems
> Chair, IEEE 802 LAN MAN Standards Committee