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Re: [802SEC] +++ LMSC P&P Revision Ballot +++ Ballot on WGMembership

I vote "Disapprove", with these comments:

(1) I disagree with the premise of the rules change, which is that is 
is somehow inappropriate for new people to assume membership in a new 
Working Group. A new Working Group is just that: new. Past experience 
in a Study Group should not be a qualification.

(2) 802 works under the IEEE Computer Society Standards Activities 
Board, which,I assert, agrees with me. The CS SAB Policies and 
Procedures are in fact much MORE open to new participants than are 
the current 802 rules. They read:

"The default requirement for CSSC membership is a direct and material 
interest and willingness to participate in the activities of the 
CSSC, and attendance of at least two (2) of the three (3) previous 
regularly-scheduled CSSC meetings, except in the case of newly formed 
CSSCs, for which voting privileges shall apply to all eligible 
attendees at the initial three meetings."

(3) We should not be trying to hand ownership of a new Working Group 
to those who participated in the previous Study Group. An EC Study 
Group already has enormous power in that it drafts a PAR, which is 
binding on the future Working Group. This gives the Study Group 
tremendous clout far into the future. It's a mistake to grant it even 
more control by trying to block out new voters.

(4) A EC Study Group is an internal entity within 802. A new Working 
Group, on the other hand, oversees a PAR, which is advertised by IEEE 
as a new project. The new Working Group has, inherently, a larger and 
wider audience than a Study Group. An EC Study Group may surmise that 
a new project may have the potential for broad consensus. However, it 
needs to test its perceptions by opening a new project and see 
whether the broader consensus really exists. The looming need to face 
a broad new membership group should provide an incentive for the 
Study Group to actually spend some time thinking about developing a 
consensus. The proposed rules change will make it even more likely 
that we will see, in the future, more of what we have sometimes seen 
in the past: narrowly-defined EC Study Groups that operate quietly 
and try to avoid dealing with the wide panoply of interests. The 
changed rule will further increase the possibility that 802 EC Study 
Groups will become perceived as arcane, closed bodies divorced from 
the real world.


At 11:30 PM -0500 03/03/27, <> wrote:
>Dear EC members,
>Attached you will find the text for an LMSC P&P revision ballot on 
>WG Membership.  This ballot was approved at the Friday March 14, 
>2003 plenary session.  It is identical to what was presented at the 
>Plenary session except that per the minutes of that meeting I have 
>change the Section number to  The purpose and 
>rationale for the ballot are as given in the attached document.
>Ballot Opens:  March 27, 2003
>Ballot Closes: April 28, 2003  11:59 PM
>WG chairs, if you haven't already done so, please invite your WG 
>members to comment through you.  Buzz, please ensure this gets sent 
>to the "802ALL" email list as well. While I encourage discussion on 
>the reflector, I am trying something new this time, and have 
>included a ballot response / comment form.  Prior to the close of 
>the ballot, please fill out the attached form with your vote and a 
>summary of your comments.  Then send it to the reflector.  I will 
>accept updated forms until the close of the ballot.  I'm also open 
>to comments on how this process works.  Hopefully this will make it 
>easier for me to compile and distribute comments, and not much more 
>difficult for everyone else.  If it doesn't work, we will fall back 
>to the old process the next round of ballots.
>Thanks & Regards,
>Matthew Sherman
>Vice Chair, IEEE 802
>Technology Consultant
>Communications Technology Research
>AT&T Labs - Shannon Laboratory
>Room B255, Building 103
>180 Park Avenue
>P.O. Box 971
>Florham Park, NJ 07932-0971
>Phone: +1 (973) 236-6925
>Fax: +1 (973) 360-5877
>Content-Type: application/octet-stream;
>	name="802.0- Balloted_WG_Membership_P&P_change.pdf"
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>Attachment converted: TiDrive:802.0- Balloted_WG_Membersh.pdf (PDF 
>/CARO) (0015FD27)
>Content-Type: application/;
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>(XLS4/XCEL) (0015FD28)